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Vocal Masterclass Discussion For American Idol Season 9 Top 2 Show: The Finale


Crystal Bowersox and Lee Dewyze

Well this is it, folks! The Finale for American Idol Season 9 is here and the talented duo to be featured on stage this week are Crystal Bowersox and Lee Dewyze.

Was there ever any doubt?  Over the past few weeks, these two singers were deemed the chosen ones.

Although, I feel that, for many reasons, they deserve this prestigious honor, I am still upset that the process was not an honest one. The manipulative games are becoming far too obvious.

I, for one, am thrilled that the producers are working hard behind the scenes to make sure that major changes will be in place for American Idol next season. And it’s about time!

Crystal and Lee are not to blame for this; they gave honest performances every week and have worked tremendously hard to refine their craft. I have noticed the tremendous changes in their technical skills from Day One and, if nothing else, it proves that they do listen and take advice from the wonderful resources surrounding them.

So, Crystal and Lee, this is your moment – embrace it, relish it and savor every moment. Your work ethic, sincere demeanor and vocal talent have allowed you to achieve your dreams of success through the American Idol process. Although this is only one step towards great success, it is  a very large one and is cause for celebration!  I am truly excited for both of you!

Best of luck to both of you tomorrow evening and, to my loyal readers, please feel welcome to add your comments before, during and after the live telecast on Tuesday, May 25th.

Copyright © 2008. MasterclassLady.Com. All rights reserved.

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About Masterclass Lady

Rosanne (Giallonardo) Simunovic began her musical career in Timmins, Ontario. She studied piano with Anne Pizzale and later, at an advanced level, with Soeur Anita Vaugeois (Sister Cecile of Les Soeurs De L’Assomption in Timmins). Her vocal and accompaniment skills were nurtured by her aunt, the late Dorothea Mascioli. When Rosanne graduated from O’Gorman High School, she moved on to the University of Toronto where she continued her piano and vocal studies while attaining a Bachelor of Arts Degree. She was hired as a piano accompanist for several musical companies, most notably, the National Ballet Of Canada. She presently holds an A.R.C.T. Teacher’s Diploma in Voice from the Royal Conservatory of Music in Toronto. Rosanne has studied choral conducting with numerous well known Canadian Conductors, including Wayne Riddell of Montreal, Quebec and the internationally renowned Dr. Elmer Iseler. She has been a founding member of numerous community-based arts organizations: the Timmins Arts Council, later known as Arts & Culture Timmins, the Timmins Symphony Orchestra, and, the Timmins Youth Singers…as well as the TYS Alumnus choir, the Timmins Concert Singers. In 1987, she was also selected to be the conductor of the Timmins Board Of Education Choir, comprised of talented students from Grades 5 to 8. In 1988, she was elected to the Board Of Directors of the Ontario Choral Federation (now known as Choirs Ontario), where she served as Chair of the Festivals Committee for six consecutive seasons. In 1996, in honour of the Ontario Choral Federation’s 25th Anniversary, Rosanne was selected as one of 25 recipients of the OCF’s Distinguished Service Award for outstanding contribution to the choral art. The ceremony was presided by Lieutenant Governor, Hal Jackman. In November 1997, Rosanne Simunovic was selected by the Rotary Club Of Timmins to receive the prestigious Paul Harris Award for her years of dedication to the artistic development of young musical talent in Timmins. In August of 2002, Rosanne Simunovic was selected by the Board Of Directors of Choirs Ontario to serve as Conductor of both the Provincial Junior and Teen Choir Camps, now renamed in honour of the Camp Benefactors, Don and Lillian Wright. In November 2002, Rosanne was the one of the recipients of the Commemorative Medal for the Golden Jubilee of Queen Elizabeth II, honouring her work in the development of the arts in Timmins. Under Rosanne Simunovic’s direction, the Timmins Youth Singers and the Timmins Concert Singers have been featured in numerous choral festivals and performing opportunities outside of Timmins. In 1985, they were selected to partici

86 Responses to “Vocal Masterclass Discussion For American Idol Season 9 Top 2 Show: The Finale”

  1. Best of luck to the both of them!

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  2. I wish both of them the best too! This is reminding me of the Carrie Underwood/Bo Bice final. I liked both of them and even though I voted for Bo, I wasn’t unhappy to see Carrie win.

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  3. I am very excited and really hope they let Crystal do one of her numbers. I think they’d be silly not to. I think they’d make an awful lot of the iTunes sales. There’s a lot of people waiting. Hopefully TPTB were waiting for the finale to let Crystal make this splash and surprise us.

    I hope they both rock it tonight. I hope Lee doesn’t have any pitch problems and Crystal doesn’t have any straining problems and both’s song choices are spot on.

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  4. Jessica, I hope they are both on too!!!! Ultimately we want to be entertained and wish the best for the contestants. It is more fun when the competition is close anyway. Here’s to hoping they perform neck and neck tonight. :)

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  5. Wow that was such a lack luster finale. Crystal was really good. Lee was medicore at best.

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  6. I’ve mentioned that Crystal hasn’t been giving my favorite performances of late, but tonight she was amazing! Her last two numbers were top 10 of the year material, bravo!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    I still don’t know who’s going to win, remember Simon crowned Archie as the winner in season 8 telling him it was a “knockout” and he still lost (by quite a large margin I think).

    And hey, we get to see Siobhan perform tomorrow for the first time in weeks!!! I’ll probably be disappointed because there’s no way she’s going to be given an important number, but still….

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  7. Spoiler alert…. don’t read any further if you don’t want to know. Dial Idol predictions…

    So far Dial Idol has Lee in the lead 22-14. Interesting. I thought Crystal outperformed him tonight, especially on the last song. I like Lee too though.

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  8. Alex: interesting and I’m not surprised….

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  9. Alex:
    Since Crystal has kind of fallen off the last few weeks (not really fallen off but Lee has been more memorable) it’s easy to imagine a scenario where most of the other contestants’ fan base would’ve been more likely to latch onto Lee. I think most times fans have already made their minds up before the finale and it would take someone bombing while the other person excels to actually change things.

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  10. Shuki, yeah. One theory is that it is the viewer demographics (mostly female, 25-40). Contrary to popular belief, it’s not young girls who power vote and determine the results. It’s adult women. I could be wrong about this, but I recall reading this somewhere. Can anyone else chime in? It partially explains why the girls get voted off so early.

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  11. SRhsv that is a good point too. Lee has been very good over the last 2 weeks and therefore gained voters from those who were voted off. Good theory.

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  12. Both those theories are valid. Also, for whatever reason, the winner isn’t usually the one that was the most consistent, but instead the one that starts just OK and gets better as the season progresses. Think Jordin, David C, and Kris, nothing wrong with them, but Melinda, David A, and Adam were far more consistent and great from the get-go.

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  13. Not hating, just had to mention that Crystal again pushed her range to the limit tonight and dare I say it, at times sounded “screechy”. Simon called Siobhan’s vocal in Suspicious Minds that very same word when I thought every note in that performance sounded beautiful, just saying….

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  14. I thought Crystal was amazing tonight. She had my mom and I tearing up at her last song, which, I think, was “Up to the Mountain”? I may have my preposition wrong. They certainly were spot on with that choice for her. Lee was good, but not memorable. I will be a little sad if Crystal doesn’t win, but I think she is going to be just fine, win or lose. She has made her mark, I think. Someone will pick her up. Simon loves her. He’ll make sure she is taken care of, methinks. I don’t think “Beautiful Day” was a great song for Lee. I think he got “lost in the arrangement.” It’s quite hard to live up to Bono/U2. A simpler U2 song would’ve been better, like “I Still Haven’t Found (What I’m Looking For),” “Angel of Harlem,” something like that. Something that played to his strengths a little more.

    Kudos to both though. Two wonderfully grounded, sweet, honest people there couldn’t be … except David and Archie, and Adam and Kris. LOL.

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  15. I must say that this was a rather disappointing finale. I think Crystal brought her game, especially that last song, which was absolutely unbelievably beautiful. I don’t know if it was nerves with Lee or what, but his performances tonight highlight the issues I have had with him all season. I can’t wait to see MCL’s critique of their performances. I kept yelling at Lee – stop raising your head! That killed his vocals! MCL has always said that this is just the worst thing you can do. You actually take the power out of your voice. That’s why Lee was practically drowned out by the background singers and band in that first number. It’s something that MCL noticed Big Mike doing in his last two performances, but I have also noticed Lee doing it quite often.

    I think Lee may have had a bad case of nerves. He was off key in his first song, the reprise of “The Boxer”. I didn’t like the idea of him singing this song again. He was really struggling with the vocals throughout the performance. He was off key in parts of each of his three performances. I also noticed that when he moved around, I think it was his last song, he totally lost his pitch. That’s a problem that has plagued him over and over again. If you are going to move around, then you have to get your vocals down first, then do the choreography. I have learned that from reading MCL’s critiques.

    The judges have never really called Lee out for his problems staying in tune and his lack of performance value. I think tonight highlighted all those weaknesses. All I have to say is, this is the finale the judges wanted and that’s what they got!

    I thought Crystal did a good job with “Me and Bobby McGee” but I did hear some shouting. The one song that I did not love was “Black Velvet”. I have never heard this song and hope to never hear it again. It’s unfortunate that they saddled her with this dreadful song. This is where I thought she really started to scream and straing her voice. The last line, when she sang the words – black velvet – right before the end, were so off key that it was painful to hear.

    The highlight of the night was Crystal’s final performance of “Up to the Mountain”, originally done by Pattie Griffin. I checked out her performance on youtube and read the history of this song. She wrote it about Martin Luther King’s last speech. I remember it very well. It was the last speech he gave before he was assassinated. That speech has always haunted me. I felt as though he was saying goodbye, like he had a premonition that he would die. I cried when he made that speech. When he said – I’ve been to the mountain top, but I may not get there with you – I don’t know if that’s the literal words in the right order, but it was beyond moving. I just had a bad feeling that I couldn’t shake after I watched it on tv. I didn’t sleep well that night and the next day he was assassinated. The song is so incredibly moving. The moment Crystal started singing, the tears started. I think she knew what the song was about and channeled the emotion. You could see it on her face. I don’t know that I have ever heard her sing a song with such impeccable, lovely, lyrical beauty. I was deeply touched.

    Crystal deserves to win this competition. Whether she does or not, remains to be seen. Nothing surprises me with this show. I realize that Lee is the one with the momentum going into the finale. I know that the voting skews heavily in favor of the guys. However, if it’s about the singing, and for me it always will be, then Crystal is the deserving winner. She brought it all tonight, just left her heart and soul on that stage.

    I am looking forward to seeing the other contestants on the results show tomorrow night. I would love to see Siobhan get a wonderful moment of her own, but am not counting on it.

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  16. Mindy, the producers know how popular Siobhan is, but they wouldn’t want her to outsing Crystal. I hope she gets a SOLO with a Guest Artist or Group. She shouldn’t have to share the spotlight with anyone else. I cannot wait to see her!

    The highlight of the night was Crystal’s final performance of “Up to the Mountain”, originally done by Pattie Griffin.

    Crystal’s final song was really good. Thank you, Mindy for providing some background on this song. Many people have not heard it and thought it was a NEW song. Lee was given a song which he could not keep up with and it was by U2 to begin with. Thank you for sharing your emotions about this song with us.

    The main emotions I felt about this last judging show for Simon was sadness because when he leaves, a lot of people will stop watching the show. Ratings will probably go down. I hope they hire a terrific judge!

    The show was pretty good, but there left much to be desired. Lee did not belong in the Finale. Sweet guy and all that, but he was outsung all night long. Now if the vote is close, the producers can decide who should win. They could also selectfully decide which votes count and which are not legit. In reality, Crystal should win.

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  17. Where I live, our cable company lost the picture for both Lee and Crystal’s last songs but fortunately not the sound. I agree with several others who said that Crystal’s voice sounded really beautiful on this song. I had never heard it before and liked it very much. She really deserves to win.

    Mindy, I was really surprised to read that you had never heard Black Velvet before last night. Unfortunately for me, I’ve heard it a lot and I have always hated that song!!! I was disappointed that Crystal had to sing it.

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  18. With the last song sung on this season, I’m done with idol. Thank you MCL for all your work over the seasons has been great!

    The only way I will watch again is if they scrap the judges table. Double the hosts money and save a ton! Let the contestants pick their own songs….Fuller is not very good at picking songs. I have never like Black velvet so for me Crystal did ok…what an awful song choice. Crystal sang the last one really well but she just did not get my full attention like she did on Me and bobbie mcgee. Both of Lee’s last two song were not good picks either.

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  19. I just read something about Lee and Crystal performing with Joe Cocker tonight!!!!!!! I LOVE Joe Cocker and can’t wait to see that!!!

    http://www.hollywoodlife.com/2010/05/24/joe-cocker-sings-with-lee-dewyze-on-american-idol-finale/

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  20. Lee :-) :-) :-)

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  21. Unlike many people here, the technical aspects of singing are something I know nothing about. Unlike many people here, writing in an eloquent and diplomatic fashion is alien to me. The only thing I have to offer is an honest and straight forward opinion based on what I believe the reality of American Idol to be. To me, technical ability has never been and will never be the decisive factor in who wins American Idol. In most instances, what will always carry more weight with the majority of people is how well someone can relate to a performer, and how deeply that performer touches ones soul. That person, for each voting individual, will be the contestant they vote for. The majority of voters will vote for the person they most relate to. In some case that will in fact be the singer with the best technical ability, but in most cases, it will not.

    Many people like to say this is a singing competition and the winner should be the best singer, but what people don’t want to accept is that until America stops voting, the likelihood of that happening is marginal at best. How easy it becomes for us to delude ourselves into thinking that the best singer should, or will, win; and how easy it is for us to be upset when they don’t. But I believe we do this to ourselves. We do so because we forget that in the end, in almost all scenarios, the majority of people vote with their heart, not with their ears; and disagree though many may, that really is the long and short of it. What we personally think things should be and what things really are can quite often be in direct opposition to one another. In the end this is a TV show where the judges are not experts/professionals in that field, but are just your average “Working Class Joes” hoping their favorite wins. I don’t mean that in a bad way. I just think that’s pretty much the way it is whether any of us want to accept it or not, or whether that’s the way we think it should be or not.

    I don’t think there will be much, if any, dispute that Crystal sang and performed better than Lee last night. And I also don’t think it matters that she did. The one thing Lee has done more successfully than Crystal is that he has captured more people’s hearts than she has. Because he has done this, he will win this competition. I believe that will be, and most often is, what it all boils down to.

    Personally, I like Lee better than Crystal, but I would have no problem with Crystal winning. In fact, with the exception of one season when I let my emotions get the better or me, it has never really mattered to me who wins, because here’s the thing….Whether a contestant wins or not, if I want to listen to them, I can buy their CD and do just that. If I want to see them live—I can do just that. To me, that’s so much easier than getting into a heated discussion and staunchly defending a position about who should have won and why. Like this or not, if we are going to be honest with ourselves, we most assuredly will then have to admit that our personal position holds little *lasting* significance to almost everyone except us. Let me say too, that in the grand scheme of Idol, most voters do not care what anyone else thinks anyway. Unless of course that person makes it known that they think like you…then for a season, they become your new best friend, lol.

    This is all I know for sure. I like watching Idol, but I think for the most part, over its 9 year run, I have been able to put it in its proper perspective. In other words, I’d give up every episode I’ve ever seen and every word I’ve ever written about it to be able to go back in time and see Secretariat run the Belmont for the Triple Crown. Now that, and not anything I’ve ever heard on Idol, is what I would call, PERFECTION!

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  22. Skid…Perfection!!! Well said! I will be the one to say that last night Crystal left me with a feeling that she was pushing to hard and it made her sound at times screechy! They both however, deserved to be the top two, they both are winners!

    As an ex-exercise rider…I would not only like to go back in time and see Secretariat, I would have loved to have been the jockey who got to feel first hand this horses amazing talent and his amazing heart!
    Yes! PERFECTION

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  23. Vonnie and Skid – to Secretariat win that Belmont. Absolute perfection. (A movie about his owner Penny Chenery is coming out in the fall … Disneyized of course). Vonnie – I wish I had been able to be an exercise rider, but I’ve always had trouble with my weight, and even so, didn’t have the right connections. I rode OTTB in the hunters and jumpers, though.

    I think, to use yet another horse metaphor, Crystal has the heart of a classic distance champion. Maybe I should compare her to Rachel Alexandra, gone against the boys and won! Both she and Lee are class acts. Hopefully they won’t get retired to stud or the broodmare barn too soon.

    Crystal does have her screechy moments, but I think they are correctable. AI is a whirlwind and with some retrospection and hopefully more voice, she’ll be able to work on it. Her last song showed us a glimpse of what she will reveal in her own songbook. I’m so excited for her future.

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  24. Skid, you may not be diplomatic (personally, I don’t have a problem with it if you aren’t), but you are plenty eloquent. And I agree with everything although, on average, I prefer Crystal to Lee. But Lee, I must confess, has probably gotten to me more than Crystal has when he is doing what he does best (Treat Her Like a Lady, That’s Life, and A Little Less Conversation). It’s his erraticness (is that a word?) in terms of what might show up in any given performance that drives me just a tiny bit nuts.

    I’ve read that Lee went out of tune on each of his songs last night. Now, I admit that I wasn’t glued to the set, so maybe I missed it. Or maybe my ears aren’t good enough. So while those who do have good ears can hear it, I’m willing to bet that alot of America has no idea . . . And I do think he’ll win. God bless him. He’s a good guy and will probably appreciate the win more than Crystal will. And she’ll have a recording contract whether she wins or not.

    Will we still be hearing from any of them in ten years? Who knows — and who can say that about any artist, anyway?

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  25. Jessica T,

    I rode for a training track in the early 80’s, a tough time for female riders who wanted to be a jockey. Julie Krone stole my dream when she became the first woman to win the Kentucky Derby and from there the fisrt female Triple Crown winner. Oh well, somebody had to be the first! I got a chance to see her ride in Maryland, Awesome!

    I now ride Hunter/Jumper’s with the desire to switch to Dressage so that in my older years I can compete for the USET…big dreamer, I am!!! LOL

    Glad to know there is a kindred spirit on here!

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  26. I would love to go back in time and see Secretariat win the triple crown again. I saw it the first time and that is a moment that I will not forget.

    However, what that has to do with perfection in vocals or even this show, I have no idea. I think it’s important to not give this show more meaning than it deserves, but to still respect what it is about. We have had some truly great singers as our Idols over the years. So please don’t tell me that it’s never about pure great singing! That is simply not the case. If our standards have been lowered over the years and now it’s just a popularity contest, so be it. I have long since come to terms with the fact that my personal vocal tastes will most likely not match the majority of the viewers who watch this show.

    I appreciate everyone’s opinions here and respect the right of all of us to have our thoughts. I will never change my standards to make them more in sync with what American wants or likes. I will never change my belief that great technical skills and singing on key and using proper enunciation and being able to tell a story with your voice, is what is most important to me. I think everyone’s individual tastes and preferences should be respected. I have no problem with someone winning due to likeability, personality, connecting with viwers or whatever. I still get to say who I think was the better singer in the finale. For me that person was Crystal. It wasn’t even close. The actual vote may end up being close, but for me there was no question as to who is objectively the superior singer.

    The producers and judges got what they wanted. I do not think that Lee was even close to being one of the two best singers in this competition. There are some great singers from the past who had such exceptional voices, that their own individual technical deficiencies could not manage to take away from their greatness. However, they are few and far between. Lee is not one of them. To some here who like Lee, this may seem unfair. I have no problem with anyone supporting Lee, lovig his voice, liking his smile or his eyes or anything else about him. He is a wonderful young man who has talent. For me it’s just not good enough. Those are my standards and they will never change. I will never lower them or just go along to get along, or be with the majority. It took me a long time to respect my musical ears, to understand what I was hearing and why, to be comfortable with being different and not hearing what everyone else did. Now that I have reached that place of acceptance, I can state my opinion with quiet confidence and a sense of peace.

    I think someone like Mike would have been much more deserving of being in the finale with Crystal. I knew it wouldn’t happen. I am okay with whoever wins. It will not affect my life or my world. I do have perspective as to the relative importance of this show. In the end, I know what I heard and that was an exceptional vocal display by Crystal. I congratulate her and, no matter what the outcome, she is a winner. I wish both Lee and Crystal success as they pursue their respective careers. I did not feel the connection to Lee and that’s pretty much the whole story for me. I can see why others like him, but for me he is not a strong enough singer and the performance value has not been there consistently enough. Lee has had some great performances in this competition, in which I felt everything all came together. Last night I didn’t feel that anything worked. He wasn’t terrible or awful, just not good enough for me. That does’t mean that I hate him, or don’t think he deserves to have a musical career.

    This is just my opinion and it’s important because it’s mine. If it’s not the same as the majority who may vote him the winner of Idol this season, that’s fine with me. I will always follow my heart, listen to what my ears are hearing and respect my own personal standards. I will listen to the beat of my own drummer.

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  27. Vonnie – can you email me? seamusmalcolm@cox.net

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  28. Mindy,

    In your shout out that you hear what you hear, and that you hear in perfect pitch is telling those of us who may or may not hear in perfect pitch that what we are hearing is not worth listening to.

    I may not hear in perfect pitch, but I know what sounds good to my ears, Crystal didn’t sound good to me last night. Lee! I like his voice, it is pleasing to my soul.

    So, please don’t in a round about way tell me that what I am hearing is no good! Beauty, is in the eyes and ears of the Beholder!!!

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  29. Mindy,

    I don’t think anyone has ever hinted or suggested that you shouldn’t say what you feel. And the fact is, you always do. And I think you know I was using the Secreatriat reference as a comparison about significance, not vocals. To infer otherwise, was in my opinion, the result of your discontent with me for what I posted, and nothing more.

    I was simply expressing how I feel the MAJORITY of the viewing public approaches this competition, and has since the shows inception. Apparently, you are not in that majority, and quite frankly, I never have thought you were. If you took what I wrote personally, that’s comes from your thought process, not mine. So to respond to me in the “scolding” tone you often do when you don’t like what I write is highly unfair, from where I sit.

    You have to know, you’re “talking” to someone who also will not be swayed by popular opinion. If that were the case, I would never post what I do here, nor would I post it in the way I do. Don’t you think I know it garners me no favor with the “majority” of posters here to post as I do? Regardless, just as you, it won’t stop me from doing so.

    I dont think it’s necessarly me that needs to be respectful of others’ opinions. And I’ll leave it at that.

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  30. Vonnie,

    You are someone that I have admired, but I really take great exception to your comments. Not once have I ever said or even implied that anyone else isn’t able to hear what they hear. You are just intent on trying to pick a fight here and that is unfortunate. I have really tried to be kind to you, but this time I am quite insulted. You have painted me in a very unflattering light and I do not appreciate it at all! I deserve better than that. All I did was give my opinion and say why I feel the way I feel. If you want to take insult at my saying that I respect what my ears hear, then that is your problem.

    You have completely twisted and distorted everything I said. I don’t know why. I can’t pretend to know what your motives are in calling me out in this way. I think your comments are out of line and inappropriate.

    It seems to bother you greatly that I acknowledge the fact that I have musical pitch perfect ears. That is your problem, please do not make it mine. I have never, ever said in any way that anyone isn’t allowed to like what they like. You know that all too well. I have bent over backwards at times in the past to try and make things right with you, but after reading your last comment, I think it better that we not address each other. I have tried so hard to be a respectful member of this site, but you pretty much just told me where to get off. You obviously did not read what I said or you would know that I acknowledged why people like Lee. All I said was that I hear it differently. I dislike feeling that I have to apologize to you for hearing things the way that I do.

    This has been quite upsetting to me. I am not accustomed to having someone deliberately misinterpret what I have said. I think that I am done with any comments on the finale. It’s clear that if you disagree with some people here, then they will call you out in the most unseemly manner.

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  31. skid,

    I did not see your post before I wrote my reply to Vonnie. It would appear that the two of you are intent on ganging up on me for daring to disagree with either of you. It’s quite disappointing, to say the least. If you are offended by my characterization of your comparison to Secretariat, then you are reading something in my comments which was not intended.

    It’s interesting that some here can dish it out, but can’t take it. I am not going to be intimidated from saying what I feel, merely because I am being attacked by both you and Vonnie. Both of you are doing this because I stated my honest opinion and you disagree with it. You are the ones who are taking this finale way too seriously. If I said what you both wanted to hear and sang the praises of Lee, then all would be well, at least for now or until any other time in the future when I dared to disagree with either of you or think for myself. I stand by everything I said. If you find it disrespectful, then maybe you should reread your initial post and see if you displayed a respectful tone before you start calling me out about mine. You are the one who was lecturing those of us who think for ourselves, do not go along with you or Vonnie, and have a mind of our own.

    I dislike the implication that I take this show seriously. I have a clear perspective on what is important in my life. It’s fun to come here and share my feelings with people. Until now, it’s been done in a dignified way. However, this is degenerating into something that doesn’t feel comfortable to me at all. It’s hard to stand one’s ground at times. That is all I have done. Your overreaction says more about you than it does about me.

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  32. Mindy:

    You have no right to put words in my mouth nor to accuse me of doing something that I am not doing. This accusation that somehow Vonnie and I are ganging up on you is LUDICROUS! The only one who is doing the attacking here is you.

    No one else has indicated that my post was an affront, in fact, moreso the opposite. The people prior to you that responded clearly understood what I was trying to say. It seems to me that you were the only one who took it in a way other than the way in which it was But I guess that’s my fault. I’m sure in the end it will be. In fact, I can almost guarantee it.

    I can only tell you this. I’m not trying to stop you from saying what you want, nor am I trying to intimidate you. For goodness sakes, who is the one that is taking this way too seriously?

    I’m done, because it’s not worth it. You win, Mindy. There, does that make you happy?

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  33. skid,

    No, you win! Because I am done with posting here. The price is too high. This has gotten way out of hand. I didn’t appreciate your analogy of Secretariat in comparison to this show. Simple as that! God forbid that I should disagree with what you say. So everyone got what you said and appreciated and complimented you! That means that I have to be the odd man out, as it were. Again, intolerance for a different opinion if what’s going on here. I have been here too long to have to listen to this kind of attack. I have done whatsoever to do deserve it, except to express my own opinion.

    If you are going to post comments patronizing and condescending to others and presume to lecture everyone else as to how they should feel or think or whatever, then you should be prepared to have someone who just might have the temerity to disagree with you.

    I am being attacked for daring to say that I have pitch perfect ears, as though that somehow demeans anybody else here. I guess I should have just kept it to myself, but I thought that I could share it with people here and rejoice in finally being proud of having a gift. I know now that I was wrong. Even though I tell everybody that they hear what they hear and it’s as real to them as what I hear. It doesn’t matter what I say, because it will be distorted. There are obviously some hard feelings here and it’s unfortunate. It’s also quite disrespectful to MCL.

    I have tried to share generously with people on this site. I thought it was appreciated. I see by your comments that I was wrong.

    So – you win!! Does that make you happy finally? You have managed to silence my voice here. I won’t bother to dare to ever say what I think, because I know what will happen if I do. It’s such a shame that it had to come to this. I honestly thought this would be a haven from all the hatespeak that is so prevalent on other forums. I was totally wrong.

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  34. Mindy,

    Whatever!!! I think that I have been more than respectful of you and others on this site…I think that I took quite a beating over my not liking Siobhan. I’m tired of apologizing for having an opinion!

    You crashed our party we didn’t crash yours! Skids reference to Secretariat was not in the least inappropriate. This show is a reality show, it is made up, so that we have something to talk about. Secretariat was real and beautiful, a horse with so much heart that it is breathtaking…I agree with Skid, if I could choose between watching that magnificent horse run or watching 9 years of a reality TV show, hands down I would take Secretariat.

    But this all goes back to the exact thing you are telling us…It’s all a matter of opinion!!!

    Like

  35. Participating in on-line communities can sometimes be so difficult. I first started on the official site for American Idol during season 8. It was so much fun. But, I vividly remember one night when I clashed with someone I had never interacted with before. With each post, our interchange became more and more heated. Just a small flame quickly became a wildfire.

    Later that night, I wrote about a post about listening to Mad World and what it meant to me. That day, I had spent quite some time counseling a young woman whose father had just died in her home country. She had the look of death on her, and I was afraid that she was suicidal. When Adam sang “Teacher, look right through,” I moved to tears.

    The woman I had clashed with read that post, and we began to talk afresh. We realized that our assumptions about each other, based on just a few lines of text, were very incomplete and off-target. We had been so quick to assume the worst of each other. We then began to seek each other’s humanity.

    Behind every username here is a real person whose story we cannot even begin to imagine. We are all real people with real feelings. And, feelings can get hurt.

    I’ve just begun posting here. I’ve had positive interactions with you all. I don’t know your backstories or what prior conflicts have precipitated this exchange. I have no opinion about the specifics of your argument here. I’m not interested in taking sides. But, what I do see is an escalation of posts very much like what I experienced a year ago at AI. I was upset and very hurt, and so was my sparring partner. In the end, I discovered a good person who expressed caring and concern for me on a night when I very much needed it.

    Incidentally, that student came back to see me again and again as she struggled with a deep depression last spring. Then I didn’t see her for many months until two weeks ago. She’s so much happier. Knowing her put everything in perspective for me.

    I hope that all those who have said that they would no longer post on this forum might take some time to reflect on all of the good conversations that have taken place on this forum and come back when they feel ready to do so.

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  36. Sue,

    Thank you for your post, it was very thoughtful…it is hard sometimes because we don’t know each other on a personal level, only what we can get from a post.

    I too hope those that have decided to leave, decide to stay!

    Skid,

    I hope you decide to stay, I really enjoy your posts!

    Mindy,

    I hope you decide to stay too!

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  37. I am so happy for Lee and Crystal…these two have been my favs since the beginning, along with a couple of others.

    It goes to show you that dreams really can come true!

    Like

  38. That was an excellent post, Sue. Personally, I always enjoy reading what Mindy, Vonnie, and Skid write as well as many others here–I don’t always agree with everything they say, but their posts make me think. I didn’t take offense to Skid’s Secretariat reference and I also didn’t take offense to Mindy’s comments about her musical standards. It seems like it’s time for everyone to take some deep breaths.

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  39. It’s late here but I truly hope that everyone can calm down and just take a step back and appreciate what everyone has contributed to this site over the years. You are all valued readers and your opinions are important. Sometimes our emotions do get the best of us – I am no stranger to this fact – and we have to move beyond the past and look to the future. Deep breathing and a sense of humor go a long way. :)

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  40. Sue, thank you for such a thoughtful post. Words in writing are indeed different than spoken words.

    Mindy, we all bring other references in to this conversation. While most of them are musical, they all aren’t, and the references that we bring are usually related to our own experiences. As a former golf pro, I know I have made golf comparisons occasionally, and I have also talked about my acting and directing experience, none of which was commented on negatively. Secretariat was an incredible horse, and we clearly have a number (at least three) horsey people posting on this site, Vonnie being the one I have longest associated with horses. If they choose to reference Secretariat in relation to perfection, that is probably a natural reference for them. The fact that it may have no meaning to you in relationship to American Idol you doesn’t matter one way or the other, but it is their reference. If you don’t get it, no problem. Just leave it alone and move on to the next thing.

    I didn’t post here till last year, but I have been reading it since its inception. And I have to say two things: one is that I LOVE that you now feel that you can embrace your perfect pitch. That is FABULOUS, and my heart aches for the fact that you were troubled by it for so many years.

    However, I follow this site regularly, and while maybe not everyone does, and so needs to be reminded of your backstory every once in a while, your inclination is to remind us in every post. Which, even though I am SURE you don’t intend it this way, nevertheless tends to make Vonnie and me (sorry for dragging you into this, Vonnie), feel a little inadequate, sort of like a backhanded compliment. I don’t, by any means, want you to deny that you have perfect pitch and can hear things that I can’t. But your constant reference to your perfect pitch does make me occasionally feel like a fool for enjoying a performance that is not perfectly on pitch. Is there a way that you can feel very uncomfortable with a singer’s performance and I can enjoy it without either of us feeling wrong?

    The other thing I’d like to say is that the tenor of your posts this season seem to me to have changed, and I often feel that I am being lectured when I read them. If you don’t intend them that way, fine, and no hard feelings. But you should nonetheless know that that is how they sound, at least to me. I have chosen to stay with this site but not respond to your comments if I felt I would put myself in a no-win situation, and I wouldn’t have if skid and Vonnie hadn’t voiced their own concerns.

    Look, I don’t want ANYONE to leave this site. But you know what? We can say that we think Crystal won the night without saying that Lee stunk. We can say that Lee gets our juices going or makes us smile without saying that Crystal was boring, or whatever else people say about her (since I’m a fan, I’m not great at this one!) We can say that we love Siobhan and miss her on the show without constantly harping on who stayed on the show longer while deserving it less. There really is a way to compliment what we love without denigrating what we don’t. And if we can manage to do that, then everyone gets to feel good about what they love. And since there are so many people on this site and they all have different tastes, allowing everyone to express their tastes without feeling badly about it would really be ideal.

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  41. Jeanne,

    OMGosh…you said exactly what I was thinking but, I couldn’t get the words to come out the way you did, Thank you!

    There is nothing that I can add to your post you said it perfectly!

    Like

  42. Sue,

    First, I must thank you for your kind and generous words. It’s hard when you feel that you are under attack from several people, but you were so fair and unbiased and kind. Thank you from the bottom of my heart.

    I said that I would not come back here, but now that I read what Jeanne said, I feel compelled to write a response. I do have to say that I am not surprised that Jeanne stepped in to respond to this unfortunate situation. I expected it. However, that did not make her words any easier to read or to bear.

    Jeanne,

    If I am being honest, I could say exactly the same things that you wrote about me, right back to you. You described the way I feel about you. I have felt that the tone of your posts this season has been more confrontational and also tinged with an underlying hostility towards me that seems to be intensely personal. Reading your comments, I know that what I thought is all too true. To also make the comment about me repeating in every post that I have a pitch perfect ear, to the point that it makes both you and Vonnie feel inadequate or that you are somehow wrong, is the unkindest cut of all. Now I realize that sharing this gift here was a mistake. I was wrong to think that people would understand that I was just trying to speak about my journey of self-discovery. I naively thought that everyone would understand. How wrong I was!

    Whether I post anymore on this site or not, I will never, ever be able to talk about this gift again. I would feel that I was somehow insulting others here. I am an extremely sensitive person, so to read what you wrote hurts me a lot. I don’t like admitting it, but there it is. I have tried to avoid responding to you, because I have exactly the same feelings as you do. I also feel that people aren’t reading what I write, but rather putting their own interpretation into my words. I have gone to great lengths repeatedly, to tell everyone that what they hear is unique and special to them. I don’t feel superior or better than anyone else when it comes to what I hear. I don’t know how to say what some refuse to hear. It’s as though I am being blamed for someone else’s feelings of inadequacy, as though I personally caused it. I think that’s a lot to put on someone else.

    The worst part is how some have blatantly and callously completely misunderstood my comments about the Secretariat triple crown victory. I know that people who know me, those who actually are my friends, would be totally shocked to read what some have said here about what I think of Secretariat. I love horses with all my heart. Secretariat is my favorite horse and my hero, always and forever. I will never, ever forget that day when he just broke away from the pack and raced alone down the track at a blazing pace, shattering the previous record completely. I really dislike being put on the defensive, but I cannot just sit back and let people here totally misrepresent my feelings. It insults me to the depths of my soul.

    My issue had to do with why Secretariat winning the triple crown was brought up in a discussion about this show. I think that this feat is so special that I actually felt it was demeaning to bring it into a discussion about Idol. That was my objection. How it became about me not liking Secretariat or not loving horses or not respecting that achievement, well, I honestly do not pretend to know. If some here are intent on trying to change the meaning of the words I put down on this site, then there is really nothing I can do about that. I am beyond tired of defending myself over and over and over again. Things get taken out of context and twisted to mean something that was never intended. So now I am one who hates horses and the greatest race horse in modern history! My friends and family would not be pleased to see me on here defending myself to the end of time. This whole uproar has hurt my heart very deeply. I would never intentionally try to inflict hurt on anyone else. I speak with passion and can express my views strongly at times, but I have always strived to do so with respect for others in mind at all times.

    Now that you have jumped in here, to support Vonnie and Skid, it hurts even more. You have reopened the wound all over again. Then Vonnie came in and praised you to the heavens for saying what she wanted to say. So it’s unanimous. I am a terrible person, one who talks too much about her so-called “gift” to the point of offending the tender sensibilities of others. The tone of my posts has changed, I am not public enemy #1. So be it. I am disillusioned by all this and don’t see any way that I can remain here. If it means that I have to censor or edit what I say, that is not acceptable to me. To know that there are now three people who really can’t stand me, just makes me feel pretty darn bad.

    You are not reading what I write. You are reading INTO what I write. I never said that Lee stunk. However, that’s what you wrote. See, you are saying something that I did not. You talk to me as thought you are my teacher and I am the bad student in class who has acted up and must now be lectured and disciplined. You don’t see it in your own posts, but it comes across loud and clear to me. I don’t expect everyone to see things my way or to agree with me. I don’t ever try to denigrate anyone else for having a different opinion. But the truth is that I can write what I think until the cows come home, and you will never hear me.

    I have to accept who I am. It took me a long time to get to that point. I have to like who I am, know that I am a decent and kind person and have the best intentions when I come here to participate. You and I could not be further apart in our point of view. I guess we can agree to disagree.

    To MCL, I am sorry that this has happened on a site which I have come to love so much. I have tried to take a deep breath and find my sense of humor, but it has been lost in all the negativity and personal animosity here. Unfortunately, when I have been terribly hurt, my instinct is to go away and hide. That is what I need to do now. I don’t see Jeanne and Vonnie changing their opinion of me and the accusations that have been made cannot be taken back. I will always be grateful for my time here, reading your critiques, knowing that you do see me for who I am. If I tried to stay here, I would have to be so careful about everything I write, that it wouldn’t be honest. I can’t do that. Thank you for who you are, what you do and your magnificent heart and spirit.

    Like

  43. Unfortunately, there was one typo in my previous post. I want to be sure that everything is as it was meant to be written.

    I meant to say that NOW I am public enemy #1.

    Like

  44. For those who missed Siobhan Magnus on the AI9 finale due to technical difficulties:

    And you can enjoy this older post:

    http://www.idolheaded.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=856&mode=thread&order=0&thold=0

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  45. I find it rather sad that people here are being so critical of each other’s words. But I guess as long as we’re comfortable writing strongly opinionated pieces, we put outselves out there for criticism and shouldn’t be completely surprised when it happens. I am not directing that comment at any one person, but instead to anyone who is willing to do that.

    All that is left to say is thank goodness the show has ended this year. Hopefully by the time another Idol season rolls around, all will be forgotten.

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  46. I must say that this is getting almost silly funny! That we would be on here arguing about Secretariat…???

    Mindy,

    If I may; skids comment to me meant that in the scheme of things there are things to take your breath away and be serious about and then there is American Idol…we cannot take this show serious, because TPTB don’t even take this show serious! If they did we would have never had a contestant make top 24 like Haley Vaughn! They would be in search of the very best of the best, I don’t know that we get 24 of the very best!

    For my praising Jeanne, she said what I wish I could say, my words don’t flow like hers. At times you have made me feel that what I hear is not technically correct. Many times when I would be having a converstaion with J, about what I was hearing in Siobhans voice, you would say that she was not nasally. To me she was, and so from that I didn’t like her voice…but I would never have went so far as to say that she didn’t deserve to be in the top or even to win, I think on more than one occassion I stated that I thought that she was adorable and she very much deserved to be in the top three.

    If you don’t like a contestant that is fine, but please refrain from saying that they aren’t good enough!

    Your words:
    “The producers and judges got what they wanted. I do not think that Lee was even close to being one of the two best singers in this competition. There are some great singers from the past who had such exceptional voices, that their own individual technical deficiencies could not manage to take away from their greatness. However, they are few and far between. Lee is not one of them. To some here who like Lee, this may seem unfair. I have no problem with anyone supporting Lee, lovig his voice, liking his smile or his eyes or anything else about him. He is a wonderful young man who has talent. For me it’s just not good enough. Those are my standards and they will never change. I will never lower them or just go along to get along, or be with the majority. It took me a long time to respect my musical ears, to understand what I was hearing and why, to be comfortable with being different and not hearing what everyone else did. Now that I have reached that place of acceptance, I can state my opinion with quiet confidence and a sense of peace.”

    Like

  47. You are absolutely right, Mindy. My behavior on this site, at least in the first half of the season, could easily be seen as lecturing. I certainly went over the edge with the Siobhan thing, and while I had begun to reconsider my words and think that I had, perhaps, been a little too harsh, it was the postings of two people new to the board that really got my attention. They had the guts to slap me upside the head and effectively say, simply and directly, that I was behaving like a jerk and being childish. After I got over my immediate defensiveness, which is always an indication for me that my personal self-righteousness is kicking in, I went back and read it as if I was new to this site, and discovered that it was far worse than I had imagined. Consequently I came back and apologized the next day. I also set a number of personal parameters for my future behavior on this site:

    Listen more and talk less.
    Acknowledge posts that I agree with, but only comment if I truly have something new to add.
    State my opinion once and then leave it at that.
    Be briefer (brevity is not my strong suit, but I am trying!)
    Avoid sweeping generalizations (“Crystal is a wonderful singer”) and stick to my own specific experience (“The way Crystal puts her own stamp on songs makes me want to hear what she’ll do with the next one.”)
    Comment on individual performances and not the singers as a whole.
    Try to find something I truly like about singers I don’t otherwise care for so that I can share in the joy that someone else takes in them.

    I hope I have made some progress on these goals in the second half of the season. I am going to take the “off-season” to review all of my posts this season so as to have a clear idea of how my new “rules” would have changed how I handled myself this season. I hope to come back next season as a more agreeable member of this board.

    I’m sorry you feel I can’t stand you. Not true at all. I just made two comments about your behavior and how it makes me feel, not about you as a person. I love my husband dearly, but he occasionally irritates me or hurts my feelings, too. You are far more than just those two things. If you feel that my comments are invalid, please disregard them and accept my apologies. And please rest assured that I will never again post any comments on this site that you can in any way take as a personal criticism. I enjoy reading your posts and hope you will continue to participate.

    I don’t have any problem with your discussing your perfect pitch and have learned much from you because of it. All I said was that I know that all of your posts are based on the fact that you have perfect pitch, and you don’t need to remind me of that fact in every single post. Just remind me every third post in case I forget in between. 

    See y’all next year!

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  48. Jeanne,

    Have a wonderful summer!

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  49. I would like to make one more comment and then I too will let this topic rest!

    The thing that I like about this site as opposed to the many other sites out there; is that no matter how heated the conversation gets, after everyone has time to cool off and think about the discussion, everyone comes back and apologizes and moves on.

    I feel like we are all friends on here, and maybe we don’t always see eye to eye on every contestant or topic, we should always respect that each of us has an opinion and feelings that can be hurt. It makes us human!

    MCL has provided us with an amazing opportunity to come here and share with each other, even though at times we haven’t always agreed with her opinion, and some of us has voiced that we disagree. Sorry MCL

    So with that I would like to offer my apologies to Mindy and anyone that I may have offended, that was not my purpose, I only wanted my voice to be heard too!

    I hope that those of you who are taking time off until next season would reconsider. MCL has provided us with some wonderful topics during the break season. Kariann 1 and I have had some great discussions over the summer months.

    Again, my apologies for anything that I may have said that offened or hurt anyone!

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  50. I’m glad to see people coming back to talk and sort through what happened.

    Last May when the AI season finished, I headed over to Adam’s official website. I became very involved in just one thread there. We formed a community of about twenty regulars who posted every day, not just about Adam but about ourselves. We laughed, we cried, and we invested a lot of ourselves in that endeavor. We formed some incredible friendships that remain strong a year later. This summer, seven of us, including one from Europe, will meet in Los Angeles.

    I wish I could say, though, that the original community held together. It did not. We lasted from June to October. It took just one post of just one sentence to crack it open. There had been a lot of hurt feelings and misunderstandings that had been simmering under the surface. The tension quickly escalated after that one post, and the community suddenly broke apart. It was fast and it was hard. It took just a few minutes. Half of us left. Half of us stayed. I made the decision to leave. That was the beginning of the end. Now there is just one regular left.

    Coincidentally, I already had plans to meet a friend from that site just a week after our fallout. She was one of those who had decided to stay. We talked for hours trying to figure out why our community had split so quickly. It just took one post of one sentence to start a chain of posts that led to our demise. In the end, we concluded that we were all good people, all invested in making our community work. But, we all came with our own histories and perspectives, and we couldn’t find the common ground that we had all been seeking.

    Within that chain of posts, there was one post made about me that I’ve never forgotten. I hadn’t realized that the poster, whom I had considered a friend, had been unhappy with some of my comments. I had no idea really. I wish that I known earlier how she had felt. What she said about me hurt. That was a friendship that I lost. I still wish that I had it. I wish we could have worked through that misunderstanding.

    I am very new here. But, I see people who are really invested in this site. It’s a special place. It’s obvious that you all care about being here. And, I suspect that despite your differences, you all care about each other. While I’ve retained some incredible friendships from that thread, I still miss the sense of community we once had. I hope that you all continue to talk honestly and openly and most importantly that you continue to seek a common ground. It’s worth the effort.

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  51. Thank you for sharing this, Sue. You are a lovely addition.

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  52. The problem with blogs and e-mail is that it is so easy to misunderstand someone’s meaning because you can’t hear the inflection in others’ voices or see the expression on others’ faces. Once I was completely misunderstood on an e-mail message, so I’m speaking from personal experience. Sue’s post was a very interesting example of trying to maintain friendships without TRULY “knowing” each other.

    I thought Jeanne had a terrific suggestion about setting some guidelines for herself when posting here:
    “Listen more and talk less.
    Acknowledge posts that I agree with, but only comment if I truly have something new to add.
    State my opinion once and then leave it at that.
    Be briefer (brevity is not my strong suit, but I am trying!)
    Avoid sweeping generalizations (“Crystal is a wonderful singer”) and stick to my own specific experience (“The way Crystal puts her own stamp on songs makes me want to hear what she’ll do with the next one.”)
    Comment on individual performances and not the singers as a whole.
    Try to find something I truly like about singers I don’t otherwise care for so that I can share in the joy that someone else takes in them.”
    I will try to set some guidelines of my own.

    Like

  53. I am going to make one last post here and that will be the end of it. And so that everyone knows, this post was being worked on at the time when the last two posts on the board were by Louise and Vonnie. Any posts that have been applied since then are ones I have not read. Having acknowledged that, it is also true that whatever those posts may say, they would not alter my views on this incident in the slightest anyway. We all see this how we see it that is for sure. It isn’t my intention to change anyone’s mind how they personally view this. It is only my intention to express how I view it. I do want to say neither am I mad or upset now, nor was I yesterday. Anger is a wasted emotion; one which I seldom allow myself to feel. It is just that I approach things head on and straight forward, and have done so all my life. I call it as I see it. I did that yesterday, and intend to do so now. That doesn’t mean I’m mad, or hurt, or feeling dejected. Just means I’m being me.

    Mindy:

    The first thing I want to make clear is that Vonnie’s post was not yet showing when I came back here and read your post. I responded to what you wrote and that was that. It was only when I came back after that post that I saw what Vonnie had written. I can’t speak for Vonnie, but it certainly does seem that it’s possible she felt your post to be somewhat scornful as well. For the record, while we both arrived at that conclusion, we did so independent of each other and without knowing that we both interpreted it the same way. Regardless of that, there is no question that it was easier for you to accuse us of “ganging” up on you than it was for you to seek the truth, and, as you wrote in a post to me, “that says more about you than it does about me.” I don’t want or need an apology from you, but I do think you owe Vonnie one for what we now know was an unfounded accusation. And I think you owe Jeanne an apology too. She was merely being honest with you about how she felt about your posts, and rather than just keep that between you and she, where it should have stayed, you took it one step further and accused her of “taking sides” with Vonnie and me, as if anyone here viewing this in a way other than which you think it should be viewed is “taking sides” against you and not just expressing their thoughts about your posts.

    As far as my overreacting, honestly, I don’t believe I did. Apparently, the “berating” tone that I felt your words took on in your initial post was somewhat accurate; verified by your own words in a subsequent post that you felt “I was demeaning Secretariat’s feat” by using that comparison in my post. Whether you “see” it or not, the words in your post reflected your discontent, at least they did so with me. Had they not, how could I have reached the conclusion that you disliked the comparison (a fact you since have admitted to be true) to begin with? I didn’t just pull it out of thin air, did I?

    While I don’t know all the conversations that have taken place between you and other posters on this site, it may be entirely possible that others have in fact read into your posts. But what I will say is that my opinion is that I don’t think I did that at all. I am of the opinion that, as I said, you took my post personally, and am also of the opinion that your words showed just that. I said your post, which is essence is your WORDS, took on a scolding tone, and also said I was of the opinion that you too may be guilty of being disrespectful. In return, you accused me of conspiring with another poster on this site to gang up on you, attacked me personally by calling me condescending, patronizing, and lecturing…AND… and this is the coup de gras, stated that I managed to silence your voice here. Well, like I wrote…it will be my fault in the end…I can almost guarantee it. And sure enough, it is, isn’t it?

    I attacked the tone of your words, and stated that you yourself might need to make sure you are giving of the same respect you are so demanding of receiving from others. Yes, that is true. But the only one of us who attacked the other’s character here was you. Do you bear any responsibility for that? Or would you like me to accept the whole of the burden? I can, and will. It’s really no big deal. Just something I wanted to point out to you, that’s all.

    In my opinion, you have made some horrific accusations here, Mindy. You have accused others here of “not being able to stand you,” of viewing you as “Public Enemy #1,” deliberately misinterpreting what you have written, and the list goes on. You’ve accused me of telling others how they should feel? Has it occurred to you that you are telling others how they DO feel?

    But the one thing that really stands out to me is that you have accused people of deliberately, blatantly, and callously misinterpreting what you have written; which, in my opinion, implies that you think this was all intentional. Do you really think that somehow, making you feel bad was so important to me or anyone else here that this was done on purpose? Mindy, let me say, while you have offered many exquisite and profound posts on this site, and while you may be very important to others on this site, you’re not so important to me that I would intentionally lay in wait to pick a fight with you simply because you didn’t agree with me or didn’t agree with someone who it so happens I have a “friendly” relationship with on this site. And I am not going to sit back and allow you to imply that I would.

    No one else that read my “disrespectful” post before you commented on it felt it was as disrespectful as you believed it to be. If they did, they didn’t indicate that. And neither have they since. And while you are one to “march to your own drummer,” I think there are many other posters here who are cut of that cloth as well, and had they been offended, would not have hesitated to express that. At the very beginning of the post I said all I had to offer was an honest and straight forward OPINION. You seemed to be the only one who took opinion to a whole other level, which I still believe, in my opinion, to have been that you took the post personally. If that is so, and only you really know, then that was of your doing, not mine.

    I can take anything you want to dish out, and was not going to reply any further on this matter, or this site, at all. But the final straw was you’re making me the one responsible for why you no longer are going to post here. There are only two people who can stop you from posting here, Master Class Lady, and yourself. I am not responsible for your decision, and you have no right to place the responsibility of your decision not to post here anymore on me. And I REFUSE to leave here letting that go unmentioned.

    This is much more your site than mine. You have much more to offer everyone here than I do, and I mean that sincerely or I would not write it. I have no problem leaving here and letting you do your thing so that you can do so without the fear of the retribution and retaliation you feel you have had to endure lately; which, I must say, I most certainly do feel is unfounded. It has been fun here, but being here and the value of what this site has to offer us on a personal level means much more to you than it does to me. It’s all yours, Mindy. Enjoy and embrace it. And whether you believe it or not, that is coming straight from the heart. Even though you think otherwise, I’m not entirely the terrible person you have characterized me to be. We’re not that much different really, you and I. We call it like we see it. We just see it from different sides of the coin.

    I know that all of you here will be able to resolve your differences and continue on next season with a new and fresh outlook. At least that is what I hope for all of you. Thanks so much, everyone! It has been fun! And please know, this is something I want to do, so don’t’ feel bad or feel it is of anyone’s doing other than my own as to why I have made the decision I have.

    Enjoy! And all the best to each and every one of you!

    skid

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  54. Ah! Skid, Please don’t leave this site, I enjoy our conversations so much, and feel that maybe I dragged you into this mess in the first place. I should have kept my mouth shut and not responded to Mindy!

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  55. Jeanne,

    I wish that you would re-consider and stay on here, I enjoy so much reading your posts and sharing in conversations with you!

    Please re-consider!

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  56. Vonnie, you and J are the main reasons I come here, and I don’t mean to disparage MCL by saying that. You make me laugh and J teaches me things about singing, and believe it or not, I see some of myself in each of you.

    While I don’t know you personally, I can’t imagine anyone not liking you! I bet a lot of people smile because of you!

    I didn’t mean that I wasn’t going to post again, I’m just aware that most people disappear once Idol is over and don’t resurface until the next Idol season begins. The fact that you remain over the summer gives me reason to stick around during the “dry” months. In fact, I’ve missed your presence during these last weeks!

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  57. Oh dear, what did everyone think about the results finale? Can we try to start over?

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  58. Jessica,

    That sounds like a splendid idea. I would suggest moving over to a more recent thread to continue talking about the finale.

    Because I’ve been there, I’d like to make another comment or two about my experiences of being involved in a very close on-line community that fell apart. It’s really easy to feel very isolated, alone in your room, with just words on a computer screen to ponder, to feel that you have lost your voice and that you are not longer appreciated.

    In the long run, we can argue about who is right and who is wrong in any given situation, but I’m not sure that it always matters. What sometimes can be more important is the effort to recognize each other as people who matter even if we don’t always agree.

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  59. Oh! Jeanne, Behave…you’re making me blush!!! :-)

    Thank you so much for your kind words you are so sweet, and I am so glad that you are on this site, I enjoy your posts so much and you are so much fun to have on here!

    Have a great day, my friend!

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  60. Mindy,

    I have been seriously taking in consideration your take on singing, I understand that from a technical standpoint it must be hard for you to listen to someone who is in your eyes less than perfect (not saying that in a mean way, just stating an opinion of what you may hear). Those of us here who like music and enjoy the show, but have no technical training must be and I’m sure are very challenging to you! I am about as un-educated about music as a chimp is doing brain surgery…I just enjoy music and unless someone is really off key do I even notice and then it has to be really blatant.

    I will try not to bore you with my horse metaphor…but you know the drill, here goes anyways! When I ride my hands and arms are soft and supple so that any movement from my horses head doesn’t unseat me. I see riders all the time with stiff locked elbows on an angle and the entire time they are up their position stays locked, then the slightest movement from the horses head, they are unseated. So you’re wondering what this has to do with music, right. Well, I’m not sure where I’m going with this…Just kidding! What I’m trying to say is that I ride my way not to please anyone else and how everyone else rides is totally their business, if someone asks me about having soft hands I share with them how to get them, but if they don’t~I don’t volunteer the information. I am not trying to brag here only going to state a fact and only state it once…I ride with a very balanced correct seat, am I perfect! no, but as far as equitation is concerned it is very good. Would I compromise my seat just to go along with how everyone else is riding, NO! So I understand your comment now about not lowering your standards just to go along with everyone else’s opinion of someone!

    I guess for me I don’t take this show seriously and I only watch purely from an entertainment stand point. But for someone who has an ear for music, I ‘m sure you are tuned in, in a totally different way than I am. Much like if I am watching a class of student’s ride I am watching from a different mental position than you would be if you were watching my class of students, you may pick the pretty horse or the cute little girl with pig-tails, while I am watching the “technical” parts of the class. What I know looks good may not be what you are drawn to, so if I pointed out someone to you that was on a margin of being perfect, you may wrinkle your nose and say yeah, but I like that little girl on that cute little pony over there, and I would totally understand where you were coming from…you are looking at the visual that is pleasing to your eyes, you are not looking with a trained eye.

    So what I am saying is that I get it, I understand your take on this whole singing thing…but if I may I would like to offer one bit of advice that will go a long way. If you came to my barn and picked the
    little girl with pig-tails on the little pony that both are the cutest darn thing you’ve ever seen and dissed my top student because she wasn’t the visual that caught your attention and you thought she was just okay…I would smile at you and understand exactly from where you were standing where you were coming from…the untrained eye-vs- the trained eye, and at the end of the day you enjoyed your time watching my class and that little girl and cute as a button pony stole your heart and made you smile…then God truly blessed you for the day…because it made you happy! Am I mad that you dissed my top student, No! I know in my mind she is shear perfection on that horse, and at the end of the day that is all that matters, I wouldn’t want to try and change your mind! I would have to give you lessons in order for you to understand what I was seeing-vs-what you were seeing.

    So at the end of the day…I don’t want to take singing lessons, so I guess what I am asking is please just let me be blissfully ignorant and enjoy my show and Smile because someone blessed my heart and made me happy with their song!

    Sorry to get so long winded!

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  61. I love horse metaphors. I’ve been trying to teach my dad, who is a newbie to horse racing fandom (and occasional betting). He asks how you can tell if a horse is “rank” which seems totally obviously to me. Uh, when it’s head goes up and opens his mouth when the rider/jock takes a hold. It’s so obvious to me (and logical), but it goes to show you how much an eye, or ear, needs to be attuned (no pun intended) to the subtleties of an art.

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  62. Vonnie,
    I applaud the time you just took to try to explain your viewpoint to Mindy. It tells me that you are a really caring person. Obviously you are bothered by the fact that Mindy has not posted here since the “disagreement.” I am bothered by it too.

    Mindy,
    I really hope you’re doing okay. I believe that you’re a sensitive person (as am I) and I am imagining that you’re probably feeling not so good right now. Hopefully you will see that there are posters here who really care about you and hope you’ll return.

    When you post about your pitch perfect ears, I just see that as a wonderful gift you’ve been given. I certainly don’t have it and I’m right there with Vonnie about enjoying music for how it touches me, not because I can understand if someone was off pitch or not. But I am NOT IN THE LEAST bothered by your take on it. We’re just simply different. I’m guessing there are others here who feel the same way.

    I always enjoy reading your posts as well as the many various posts from people here who have different levels of interest in music–from those of you who are experts to those who just simply enjoy listening.

    Personally, Mindy, I hope you will post here again.

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  63. A very nice analogy, Vonnie. And I am intrigued with the supple arm thing. Same thing in all physical activities, although I relate to it most in flyfishing and golf – loose muscles always produce better results (like the relaxed jaw in singing!)

    I’m sure you know this, but I just wanted to make clear to Mindy that we are both aware that the discomfort we sometimes feel from being reminded by her that someone like Lee has pitch problems is not something she intentionally does, and she has gone out of her way to say that she respects that we hear something different than she does. It’s just unfortunate that telling us that she respects our hearing is sometimes offset by her also saying that what she hears, having perfect pitch, is true and accurate. I’m probably paraphrasing here, but it is words like these that I think send us mixed messages. If she simply said that she finds herself unable to enjoy Lee’s performances on any level because his pitch problems are too frequent and too far off the mark for her, given the fact that she has perfect pitch, I don’t think that either of us would have a problem with that. I also wouldn’t mind at all if she mentioned it every time she spoke of his singing.

    What she hears IS true and accurate, and I honor and respect that, and I think you do, too. I don’t think either of us is trying to tell her that she should overlook his pitch problems just because WE are either ignorant of them or willing to overlook them because other aspects of his performance are more important to us. I, for one, am glad to hear her opinion of each contestant’s ability to stay on pitch, because I know I can’t judge that as well as she can. I may think that someone is able to stay on pitch consistently and be wrong, so I like to be reassured that when I think Mike is able to do so, he is in fact doing so. It has also been interesting to me to hear from both Mindy and MCL that physical movement tends to make singers go off pitch and so they have to work harder at fundamentals to avoid that problem.

    For Mindy to participate in our discussions without revealing or acknowledging her perfect pitch would be wrong and inappropriate, and I wouldn’t want to her hide that fact. I think you and I would both simply appreciate her being sensitive to the fact that she has a gift that we don’t, and our own silly human frailty makes us feel a little inadequate sometimes for liking something so imperfect. And, of course, the challenge for you and me is to learn to not be so sensitive to such a silly thing.

    You know, it’s a stupid thing, but semantics can have a subtle effect. What do you say we abandon the phrase “perfect pitch” and instead refer to it only as “absolute pitch” (which I believe is actually the correct term, musically speaking)?

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  64. Jeanne,
    I have to say that I think you were absolutely correct when you just posted that ” . . . and our own silly human frailty makes us feel a little inadequate sometimes for liking something so imperfect. And, of course, the challenge for you and me is to learn to not be so sensitive to such a silly thing.”

    Actually, I’ve been thinking the same thing. It surprised me that anyone would be so bothered by Mindy’s comments about her perfect pitch that they would call her on it. I just haven’t been able to figure out why on earth that would bother anyone!!! So what! I like performances that Mindy and others say were off pitch, but it doesn’t make me feel inadequate in the least!!! Please don’t think this means that I think I’m superior to you in any way because it does not. I’m simply saying that in the grand scheme of things, this is a not something to be bothered about.

    This has been a really silly argument and I hope Mindy returns and all will be well in MCL land . . .

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  65. Louise,

    Thank you, and I do feel bad and do not like when I think someone has been hurt by something that I have said. I hope Mindy comes back and participates in the conversation here in MCL land (I love that)! I do agree with Jeanne, we know that Mindy has perfect pitch and I am in awe of that, I wish that my ears heard what hers does, although sometimes I wonder if it is a burden for her, because I would think to a point it would take the fun out of music, until you heard that one singer who took your breath away. I just at times felt like I wasn’t being validated for what I was hearing. The tone of a persons voice or the way they deliver the song, as long as they aren’t singing so far out of tune that it is unbearable, I can usually listen to it and enjoy it.

    Jeanne,

    Supple arms and hands are the peanut butter to chocolate in riding! If your hands and arms are stiff your horse is going to be resistant and stiff, if your hands and arms are soft and supple, your horse is going to be soft and supple.

    I also hadn’t thought about the head thing that Mndy, MCL, and J are always talking about…but in riding your head can throw your horse totally off balance. If you ride down a straight a tilt your head to one side or the other your horse will travel in that direction. So I guess it does make sense to me that if your head is tilted in a way that restricts your vocal cords it would come out sounding different, not that I would know it was sounding different mind you, now that said I could be so far off base about this theory that you wouldn’t even know I was in the game!

    Glad to hear you are going to hang around for the summer!

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  66. Louise- did you start the MCL Land phrase? I love it! Nice to see your comments everyone.

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  67. Maybe a good comparison (in the horse world again) is this video of Anky von Grunsven who is debated the best dressage rider in the world. The untrained eye may look at this video and see absolute harmony between the horse and rider. The rider is quiet (soft arms!), the horse is perfectly muscled, doing exactly what the rider asks (which are the highest level Olympic movements in dressage). Although some people may call it boring, you might not deny there is a certain majesty in it.

    Watch then read below.

    In reality the type of training she is employing is of the greatest controversy in the dressage world. It is called “rollkur” – a German word. The horse is being asked to pull his nose behind the vertical and hold it for long periods of time. Instead of the poll (the point between the ears) being the highest point on how the horse carries the neck, the third or fourth vertebrae is, causing excess tension in the neck. The horse must be powerful, but relaxed. Carrying this position for extended amounts of time impedes the horse’s breathing (incidents at World Cup qualifying revealed a horse with a blue tongue after being asked to work in “rollkur” for 5 minutes+). It causes long term musco-skeletal damage because the horse cannot connect and engage its back end.

    I thought this was a good metaphor. Plus the tension in the neck applies to singing!!!!

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  68. MCL . . . I wrote, “This has been a really silly argument and I hope Mindy returns and all will be well in MCL land . . .” Glad you like it.

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  69. Jessica T,

    Isabell Werth and Lyndon Gray…all I’m gonna say, you know what I’m talking about!!! :-)

    And also to answer your question about the finale…if I’m being honest I tape it then fast forward through the things I don’t want to watch, so I went back just a little while ago and re-watched, here’s what stood out to me:

    1. If Siobhan would have sang in the same “tone, notes” I don’t know what you call it, but anywho, had she sang on the show like she did with Aaron, I would have been a huge fan, that was really pretty and that was what J and I were discussing about her voice, there are places that is beautiful.

    2. Dang, does Janet sound like her brother??? she could do Michael’s songs and you would think it was him and not her!

    3. Man have I missed Taylor Hicks!

    4. To many guest singers, I wish that they would have let all of those past Idols who showed up for the 2 minute farewell song to Simon sing! Now that would have been good!

    5. I’m gonna miss Simon!

    That’s my take on the finale…what did you think of it?

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  70. As a long-time lurker but seldom poster, I have to say that some of what I’ve read here is why I am afraid to post.
    That being said, thank you so much, MLC, for offering your incredible knowledge and insights every week throughout the AI season and beyond. You’ve given me a world-class education and I appreciate it more than you can know.

    God Bless and Congratulations to Lee Dewyze.

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  71. SondraD and Sue,

    Sue, forgive me that I didn’t say welcome sooner!

    Hi and welcome to both of you!

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  72. Hello Sondra:

    I try to make sure that the conversation stays civil because this site strives to promote intelligent, respectful conversation.

    I hope you will not feel intimidated by some of the comments – the readers in question have “cooled down” now. Sometimes, the heat of the moment makes our fingers move too quickly. Overall, the readers on this site are wonderful, thoughtful individuals.

    Please drop by once again and thank you for adding your lovely comment. :)

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  73. Vonnie, Jeanne, Darlene, Jessica, MCL, and others – Thanks for your kind welcome. I know how Sondra feels about whether to take the plunge and post on an already established site. So far, I enjoyed the experience and I’m glad that I’ve de-lurked. Now, if I can just learn everyone’s names!

    Mindy- I hope that you’ll return. You’ve been quite welcoming to me in various conversations. I appreciate that. And who else will be here to share the fun of doo-wop music?

    Skid – I really haven’t had an opportunity to interact with you much, but I hope that you will stick around and continue to bring your own perspective to the conversation. I like what Vonnie has said about being able to appreciate a performance from various viewpoints.

    J May – I don’t know if you will catch this post, but I certainly hope that we didn’t get off on the wrong foot in an earlier conversation. It’s easy to do.

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  74. I have stayed away until now, but I did want to come on here and respond to the wonderful, kind and generous posts from both Vonnie and Jeanne. I intended to come here and post yesterday, but when I came back and read Skid’s last post, I became quite upset and distraught. It’s hard to explain what reading comments like that can do to a person. Then I told myself that skid has never met me, talked to me face-to-face or looked into my eyes. So skid doesn’t truly know me. Some of what was written cut into me like a knife and it felt like it was being twisted and turned.

    I also want to say that no one gets to tell me when/if I should apologize to anyone. When some here wonder why the words “patronizing, condescending or lecturing” were used, just read the part in which I was instructed to apologize as though I were a naughty child. I truly regret that things managed to get so out of hand. The volume got dialed way up and things were said that should never have been said. Someone I know once gave me some great advice about posting on an online forum. She said that when you write something in the heat of emotion, you should take a deep breath, sit back and read it again and then decide if you really want to hit the “submit” button. I try to remember that as much as possible. Once cruel, callous words are posted on a blog, they are there forever. When I read skid’s post, I felt humiliated, embarrassed and shattered. That’s why I left without posting my sincere thanks to Vonnie and Jeanne. These are two classy women. It’s not easy to come back and reach out to someone. They could have chosen to take the same route as skid. I am glad that they didn’t.

    I know that the person I am has nothing whatsoever to do with the so-called paranoid, delusional creature I was made out to be. Words can hurt. Now those comments are here for good. I skimmed over them, because I refuse to read them again. I hope that Vonnie and Jeanne will understand if I don’t apologize at this time. I don’t think anyone here has the right to tell anyone else when/if or how they should apologize. If anyone should do it, then I think that person should be MCL. This is her site. I am sure that Vonnie and Jeanne would want my any apology to be sincere and heartfelt. That can only happen when it comes in my time, in my way, in a manner that feels right to me.

    Vonnie,

    I loved reading your horse riding analogy! I have been doing a lot of thinking and have come to a few realizations. First, I realize that my repeatedly bringing up my pitch perfect ears, can have the effect of making others feel a bit unsure or intimidated or inadequate when it comes to giving their thoughts. This was never my intention, but I can honestly see how some people would find it a bit unnerving. If I decide to stay, I have promised myself that I will try to just give my opinion without the constant reminder of having musical pitch perfect ears. I think everyone knows it by now! This is totally my own decision, done in the spirit of trying to encourage everyone to have their say.

    No one is ever right or wrong. What each of us hears is unique and special to us. Our differences are what make it so interesting to discuss. If everyone agreed with my take on the vocals, this would be a pretty boring place! I have learned so much from reading the comments of those who admit that they have no formal vocal training or a pitch perfect ear. You are one of them! You are so thoughtful when you speak about what kind of singing you enjoy. It’s real, honest and comes right from your heart. I really do understand why you like Lee. The very flaws that I hear in his vocals, are the things that you love! I stand by everything I said in my critiques about the vocals, however, I would like to make one change. I think that I was too harsh when I said that Lee didn’t deserve to be in finale. That was unfair to him. He has worked hard and improved quite a bit. I think Lee didn’t really know how good he was when he first came on the show. The mentors helped him by telling him what a great voice he had and Harry Connick Jr. helped Lee deliver probably his most confident, fully realized performance. The comments from the judges also bolstered Lee’s confidence. I actually listened to his studio recording of his debut single. With some of the little flaws erased, Lee sounded gorgeous. I may never love him as a live performer, but so what? He will do very well, become even more confident as time goes on and get even better.

    Jeanne,

    I must tell you how much I loved your list! It gave me a lot to think about when it comes to posting on this site. I am notoriously verbose and wordy and can go on and on. There his merit in trying to streamline one’s posts. I don’t know how well I will succeed, but it’s a worthy goal. I always strive to be a better person, all the while trying to achieve a measure of self-acceptance. I have to be who I am, but always try to be aware of others and how they feel. I can be passionate and strong in my comments, but part of that comes from the fact that I have been a people pleaser for most of my life. I always wanted to fit in, to belong, to conform. I silenced myself and that wasn’t a good feeling. I still have mixed feelings about this gift with which I was born. I honestly wish that I could turn it off. Some of the happiest times this season, were when the artistry of a performance trumped the vocal technical issues and I could hear it and still enjoy it. Casey’s “Jealous Guy” performance comes to mind and a few of Lee’s great performances. To me that is a victory! I can get past every little thing that my ears pick up and just revel in the moment of a memorable performance.

    The highest high I can get is when the technical vocal skills are perfect and the artistry is also there. When someone can enunciate, sing not from their throat but with support from the diaphragm, stay on key, great phrasing and tell me a story with their voice, then that to me is perfection.

    However, I would also like to make the case for imperfection! I say we celebrate that, too! Let’s toast the flaws in voices and know that many here can connect and feel that this is pleasing to them and resonates with them! Maybe in the end, sometimes it’s the imperfections that make a voice distinctive and exciting.

    I have a lot to think about. I won’t make any decisions now, because my emotions are still too raw. I am just glad that people didn’t hate me after reading what skid wrote. I thought that everyone would. If I stay, I want to be the best participant that I can be, accepting of everyone’s personal likes and dislikes and respecting their feelings at all times. I have learned so much from you and Vonnie and Louise and Kariann. All of you make me think, question and see things from a different perspective. You all have contributed much to this site. I cannot imagine it without any of you.

    I know that this has been far too long, but there is much to say and I don’t know that I will be posting for a while. I wanted to end by giving you all a good laugh and a pleasant surprise. I was listening to the results show and, when the guys did their group number and each had their own solos, I had quite a revelation. When Tim sang his little solo part, I was amazed and delighted to realize that he sounded great!! The guy can sing! What’s even more shocking, is that I could hear it! Good for Tim! I think on that note of levity, for now I will leave all of you and hope that you know that I respect and admire everyone. I have been truly privileged to be in your company.

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  75. So good to hear from you, Mindy.

    Did you see Siobhan along with all of the others on Larry King Live last night? If not, they’re all going to be on again on Monday night so try to watch. It sounds like it will be a fun hour.

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  76. Mindy,

    What a beautiful post, thank you…and I hope that you are here to stay!

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  77. I hope everyone has a safe and fun Memorial week-end…May God bless our troops who are abroad and those who have served!

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  78. Mindy,

    Your apology, if and when it comes, is for really more for you than it is for me. I forgave you for whatever hurts I felt two days ago. It is up to you to come to terms with whatever you need to in your own time, in your own way.

    I really hope you will decide to stay. This forum isn’t a perfect place, any more than the real world is, but it is nonetheless special and your absence would be felt, I think, by all of us. It is difficult to disagree on paper without risking hurting someone’s feelings, I know. I am, believe it or not, a pacifier in my real life, making sure other people are happy and finding it difficult to speak up regarding my own needs and feelings. I don’t find it much easier to do here, and in fact it is probably harder, since it is so easy to read anything that is written more than one way, depending on our mood.

    It is both sweet and sad that you would think that anyone would hate you because of something someone else wrote. We are all (I think) adults here, and fully able to make up our minds about you based on your own posts and not on anyone else’s opinion of them. You are a dear, special woman, and I am privileged to know you.

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  79. Mindy – I echo Jeanne’s statements. You are a wonderful, sensitive woman and this is why you are taking this specific blogging incident to heart. Please know that we tremendously value your conribution on this site. Thank you for your lovely post. It’s nice to see you back and in good form.

    By the way, I thought Tim Urban sounded wonderful as well during his solo at the Finale. I knew he had this beautiful, resonant voice, but this competition really drained him and we never had the opportunity to see and hear the true potential of his vocal gift.

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  80. Yeah! Glad to see all is resolved and Mindy is back. Even though I originally found this site via AI9, I love to visit and hope to participate in the discussions in the future.

    For those who are planning to attend the AI9 Concerts I am optimistic that the tour will provide a proving ground for their young talents and will allow the the contestants to develop their potential as performers.

    Happy Holidays!
    Julia

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  81. Louise,

    I forgot to say something especially to you. I wanted to thank you from the bottom of my heart for standing up for me and supporting me. It has meant so very much. Unfortunately, I do take these things to heart. I have felt like the wind was knocked out of me. However, your comforting words helped me to find the will to come back and post my thoughts. It’s reassuring to know that people will judge me by what I say and how I say it. We can only know each other to a certain extent, based on what we write here. I would like to think that what is inside me does somehow reveal itself. You are a kind soul. I will never forget the support when I needed it most.

    I have survived so much in my life, yet I have realized that I can still be terribly hurt by harsh words. You said that when you write strong opinions, you should expect a strong response. I completely agree with that. We have been fortunate here, in that we are able to disagree with passionand conviction, but always with consideration and respect. I hope this experience will make me a better participant. I still am not totally sure that I should stay. I hope to have learned something from this difficult experience. I know that this is something that doesn’t happen here and hopefully never will. Maybe I take the show too seriously, or voice too seriously. I don’t know. I just wanted to let you know that I am glad you understood where I was coming from with my reference to those pitch perfect ears. I have decided to refrain from bringing it up, only because I am concerned that some people, particularly new members or people who don’t post much, might feel that they don’t have enough knowledge to give their thoughts. I am totally okay with, so no worries!

    Thank you always and forever!

    Sondra,

    I sincerely hope that you will post your thoughts. I love seeing new people come on here to express themselves. A fresh point of view is always welcome. You have seen MCL’s answer and that should give you reassurance. She has always strived to make this place a safe haven for everyone. What happened here was something that escalated and got out of hand, but it is not by any means an indication of what goes on here. People on this site are intelligent, thoughtful, gracious and polite. I look forward to hearing your comments!

    Sue,

    Thanks so much for your kind words. I didn’t mean to leave you out, but my recent post was quite long. I have really enjoyed our conversations and am happy that you feel the same way. You have made so many insightful comments that make me think and reflect. It’s wonderful having you here.

    Vonnie and Jeanne,

    Thanks so much for your lovely responses. I was a little concerned about telling you that I wasn’t able to apologize at this time. I didn’t want it come out wrong. It’s not that I think both of you aren’t deserving of it. I just want the dignity to have it come from me, in my way, in my words and not feeling coerced because I was publicly told to do it. If I did it at this time, I just might be doing it under pressure. In my own way, I tried to do it, but in my own words, by reaching out to both of you to let you know that I understand where you are coming from and how you feel. When I feel it’s right and know that it truly is my decision to do so, feeling free from any constraints or requirements, then I definitely will have no problem doing so.

    It is kind of sad that I would think that anyone would dislike me because of some harsh words from another member. My family and friends always worry when I get into any kind of argument or disagreement, because they know that I have a tendency to put it all on myself. I can be way too hard on myself. This time I am going to cut myself a bit of a break. Things happen, feelings are hurt, emotions rule the day, but in the end, reason and compassion prevail. The world goes on and the sun will rise again. We are all just people and none of us is perfect, including myself.

    MCL,

    Thank you so much for those words. I really needed to hear them. Hopefully, this will never happen again. You have made it easier for me to know that I haven’t disappointed you. That would break my heart. I am so terribly sensitive and that can be a burden at times. However, it also makes me the person that I am. I love people and care so much.

    Yes, Tim really sounded great! I was honestly more than happy to be able to say it. He deserves it. You see, I can change my mind!

    Like

  82. Mindy,
    You’re very welcome. I’m really glad that my words helped you to find your way back here. I was imagining how I would have been feeling in your place and I knew it wasn’t a good feeling. Even though we don’t really “know” each other, I remember your references to some difficulties in your life so I knew you didn’t need this in a place where you had felt safe to express yourself.

    Just know that you have friends here, and although Idol is over for the year, I hope to see your posts from time to time. Last year I gradually stopped checking this site after Idol was over for the season and that will most likely happen this year too. But I’ll look forward to hearing everyone’s comments again next winter and I hope that you’ll be one of the posters.

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  83. You know, Mindy, I almost said earlier that I thought your post was, in its own way, adequate apology, if one were needed, but I didn’t want to put words in your mouth. The fact that you were willing to come back and be so gracious after everything said, to me, that you were trying to make amends, see things from someone else’s point of view, become a better person, and move beyond what happened — which is what I think Vonnie and I were also trying to in our own ways. And quite honestly, those kinds of actions speak louder and more tellingly than the words, “I’m sorry.” If you some day feel the need to say them, that’s fine, but I don’t need to hear them.

    I do hope you’ll be back, in part because I really, really like the Mindy of these recent posts. I like the other passionate, heart-on-her-sleeve Mindy as well, but I see yet another dimension in you, and it is a very attractive one. I understand why you’re not ready to make a decision right now. Please know that you will be in my thoughts and prayers.

    I haven’t had the chance to see the finale yet, but hope to this weekend! I am excited to hear Tim, based on your and MCL’s comments. I always thought he had a good instrument when he used it as I wished he would (the bridge on I Can’t Help Falling in Love With You), but he tended to choose bizarre phrasing that eliminated the richness of his tone (the rest of the same song). So now I am really curious!

    Off to my closing night . . .

    Like

  84. Mindy, Jeanne, Skid, MCL, along with me!
    :-) **********GROUP HUG********** :-)

    I just want to say that I feel that I should apologize to Mindy, Jeanne, Skid and MCL and all other posters…I should have handled my comments in a different way, I didn’t and so I apologize for anything that I may have said that caused hurt feelings…please believe me when I say that was not my intentions! I asked your forgiveness!

    Skid,

    I hope you come back soon, cause I sure do miss you!

    MCL,

    I think that you need to spank us and send us all to bed with out any supper!!! :-( What are you gonna do with us???

    Jeanne,

    Good luck tonight, I would say break a leg, but I really don’t like that saying, so I won’t say it…but I did say it didn’t I, well, just go out on your closing night and have a blast!!!

    Louise, Sue, and SondraD,

    Thank you for stepping in and helping pull this group back together, what wonderful people you are, and that goes for anyone that I may have missed…! Also, Louise, and everyone else, you may want to hang around for the summer, MCL provideds us with wonderful topics during the break months!

    Like

  85. I’m really, really glad to see Mindy back and feeling much more comfortable with everything that has transpired.

    However, I very much hope that Skid will find her way back as well. Skid, you clearly have friends here and you have a voice that deserves to be heard.

    I don’t see a need to designate an individual winner or an individual loser in this discussion. Either the entire site wins by bringing back everyone or the entire site loses by losing a friend.

    Like

  86. Skid…I ditto what Sue said!!! Please come back!

    Like

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